Author Topic: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway  (Read 50727 times)

Offline brackish

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #60 on: February 19, 2010, 02:33:02 PM »
Matt,

I have the new rudder on my 23, however, I've never sailed with the old one, so couldn't offer a comparison.  Any 23 folks close by or passing through want to take the helm and see if it would be worth it to make the change let me know.

I've never measured it, but think it would probably be the NACA-0012 profile.

Offline Bob23

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #61 on: February 19, 2010, 06:00:31 PM »
Mike: Yes, I agree those important decisions must not be rushed. If you need a hand doing the research, let me know!
Matt: Good point. I'll do some more research on my own to determine which foil is best for the 23. Good thing I procratinated starting it!
Bob23

(ps: I just took a peek at the Compac site and, yes, the 23's rudder blade is quite different. What really stands out, though, is the amount of the blade that is forward of the pivot point. This is something that I want to incorporate in my rudder to try to provide more balance. ie, to remove some weather helm. I know that the foil shape will help in this area but moving more of the area forward should also help.)
« Last Edit: February 19, 2010, 06:24:25 PM by Bob23 »

Online kickingbug1

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #62 on: February 19, 2010, 08:18:26 PM »
     it never fails to amaze me how much i have learned from com-pac people.
oday 14 daysailor, chrysler musketeer cat, chrysler mutineer, com-pac 16-1 "kicknbug" renamed "audrey j", catalina capri 18 "audrey j"

Offline HideAway

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #63 on: February 19, 2010, 11:11:58 PM »
Bob did you notice how big the trailing edge is too.  Both of those things have to make a big difference.  Does anybody have Doug142 web site I can t find it.   Thanks  Matt
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Offline Greene

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #64 on: February 20, 2010, 12:09:55 AM »
Matt,

Go to martindalewoodworking.com and go into his com-pac section.  He has some interesting projects in there.

Mike
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Offline Bob23

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #65 on: February 20, 2010, 09:26:45 AM »
Hey, Mike:
   I am wondering about the overall width of your new blade. Can you measure and post here? I'm having a diffucult time finding a NACA 0014 template on line... I know I found one awhile back but can't now. I have found a 0012,  printed it out and enlarged it to suit my purposes. Thanks...and thanks for sharing your blade-building adventures with us here at the site...very helpful
Bob23
(ps: Do you know what the width of the original aluminum blade was?)

Offline Greene

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #66 on: February 20, 2010, 11:38:59 AM »
Good morning Bob,

I measured the rudder and here are the dimensions;

Original aluminum blade thickness was 1/4"
Original blade width was 12"

Foil thickness at the widest point is 2"
Foil width is 13" (original 12" of alum. plus 1" of maple for the leading edge)
Note: The foil template that Doug142 printed out for me was set at 14".  This allows us to cut off the final 1" on the thin trailing edge for strength. 

I did my final sanding this morning - could use a little more but it is just a rudder.  I'm trying to convince the Admiral to break out the ol' Singer and make up a nice storage bag for it.   
Mike
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Offline Bob23

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #67 on: February 20, 2010, 08:31:59 PM »
Obrigado, Mike:
   We are all waiting to see the finished product. A 14" wide blade will probably be what I end up with.
   Funny you bring up a storage bag. My plan was to sew up a cover to be used while moored. My rudder is pulled up out of the water most of the time and I know the effects of UV on clear wood. Is having a rudder cover being too vain? I hope not.
   Any decisions on paint or whose photo will be on the blade? How about shark teeth!
Bob23

Offline Greene

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #68 on: February 20, 2010, 09:33:28 PM »
Bob,
I am surprised that your boat has a rudder with the same width as a 16.  It must be quite a bit longer. 

A rudder cover vain?  Yes, but at our age it is good to be vain about something.

I put some primer on the rudder this morning and was disappointed in the surface appearance of the fiberglass.  Too many imperfections for me to be happy with it.  Guess I'll have to put another layer of thickened epoxy on it before painting. 

I am still undecided about the paint theme for the rudder.  I tried to do some "research" today by watching the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Show, but the Admiral said, "I don't think so Buddy!"

Mike
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Offline HideAway

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #69 on: February 20, 2010, 09:40:30 PM »
To find the measurements etc google
Rudder Blades & Centerboards
By Gougeon Brothers, Inc.
1. How to Build Rudder Blades & Centerboards
By J.R. Watson

Jamestown Distributers has it as well
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Offline Bob23

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #70 on: February 21, 2010, 06:50:11 AM »
Mike:
   My blade is very long. (That didn't sound right.) In fact, it sits about 6" lower than the keel. Makes a great "You are about to run aground, Bob" warning device! When I first aquired the boat, I thought that it might've been replaced by someone so I emailed Gerry or Rich a photo but they ID'd it as a factory rudder.
   I have a suggestion for your rudder graphics but I don't have your email address and I don't yet know how to post photos here. It is from an old Glen-L catalog (1953) and used to be on thier website but has been removed. It is tasteful, I can assure you but probably quite edgy back in '53!
   Doug has graciously and prompty replied to my emailed request for the NACA 0014 template so I may actually start this project soon.
Bob23...28 days till spring...snow is melting here in NJ!

Offline Greene

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #71 on: February 21, 2010, 10:49:45 AM »
Bob,
I sent you my e-mail address.

Are you still deciding between the 0012 and the 0014?  I would think with the longer waterline you would be looking at the 0012.  Or is the speed difference between the 16 and a 23 small enough that either foil would be equally effective

I am considering just painting my rudder camoflouge after seeing it primed.  Fiberglassing still sucks.

Mike

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Offline Shawn

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #72 on: February 21, 2010, 03:05:18 PM »
Mike,

Very nice work!

"I'm trying to convince the Admiral to break out the ol' Singer and make up a nice storage bag for it.   "

Might not be a bad idea. There was a company that built foam cored rudders awhile ago that ended up having problems if the rudders got to hot in the sun. Apparently the foam shrank and the change in pressure deformed the outer skin. I tried finding the info on it again but couldn't. Don't know what type of foam they used in those.

Shawn

Offline DOUG142

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #73 on: February 21, 2010, 09:10:57 PM »
Hi all,
This thread is looking good.  Just had to get my 2 cents in.,,,,errrrr okay a picture of my NACA 0014 foil rudder.
Thanks for all the nice comments. 

 

See ya at the Carlyle Lake Rendezvous.  That's my cajun canoe that I made in the background.  Sold .
Thought I would try my luck at posting a pic within this post.
Doug
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Offline Bob23

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Re: NACA-0014 Rudder Modification Underway
« Reply #74 on: February 22, 2010, 04:31:10 AM »
Mike:
   Me not being an engineer, I don't know which foil shape would be correct. But anything will be an improvement over what I have. I thought to try to mimic the keel...hmmm...wonder which one that is? Oh, dear... decisions, decisions.
   Again, mucho thanks for all the help from you, Doug and everyone else here at the site. I actually started yesterday- removed the zinc from the blade, drilled out a new pivot hole in the rudder and rudder head. Yeah, I sail in salt water and had to replace the rudder gudgeon this year. I'm switching from SS bolts to bronze for the rudder pivot bolt and the two bolts that secure the rudder head to the gudgeon. Should help. The bottom ear of the gudgeon was well on it's way to being gone completely.
   Doug is sending me templates so I'll start a-cuttin' as soon as they arrive.
Bob23 out (of my mind, some would say!)